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Troll Sub-races catchup  discussions

2020/08/16 19:17, Troth: 
Is there any differences, besides style points, between the sub-races of cave, hill, and mountain trolls?

I suppose a similar question could be asked about the hobbit sub-races too, but that should be in a thread about food. In my experience, they all taste like chicken.

2020/08/16 20:18, IminyŽ: 
another boring thread no. 4k smthng to ignore

2020/08/16 20:53, Troth: 
Why do you comment on threads you ignore? Just ignore them and stfu. Or perhaps you don't understand the definition of the word.

By the way, not all threads are intended to specifically interest you, so no one cares if you find it boring.

2020/08/16 22:26, Cronus: 
Only thing I have noticed is character size. Height and weight.

2020/08/17 00:05, Troth: 
Ok, cool. Which sub-races are bigger (based on your experience)? Do size and weight have any impact in-game?

2020/08/17 00:54, Shaukr: 
Size can matter for eq fit and I believe for at-bay chances? While weight might impact fall damage?

2020/08/17 07:24, IminyŽ: 
I've read about this: Disaster Study Group from 'The Children of the Sky' by Vernor Vinge

2020/08/17 15:32, Troth: 
Hmm ...

Maybe this will help. ...

[submitted link]

2020/08/18 00:03, Yaul:   
Yaul is a male Hill Troll.
He is nine feet tall and weighs sixty-four stone and one pound.

2020/08/18 00:05, Yetu:   
Yetu is a male Mountain Troll.
He is eight feet eleven and weighs sixty-two stone and eleven pounds.

2020/08/18 00:45, Hrungnir:   
Hrungnir is a male Hill Troll.
He is nine feet tall and weighs sixty-four stone and four pounds.

2020/08/18 00:45, Boent: 
Size can matter like someone said for keep at bay mechanic although I haven't tested this to know if there is a difference based on char description or only between races. For trolls it matters because you can't resize equipment. If you want to wear metals as a trolls (example), some troll mobs will tend to drop metals of certain size, e.g., in filthy, warrens, etc. So, that would require some testing. Also size is based on race but it's also random. A hill troll can be bigger than mountain troll but usually will not be. A hill troll will roll a smaller size on average than a mountain troll.

2020/08/18 00:49, Moonglum:   
You are 100% wrong on sub-race troll size. I have rolled TONS of mountain and hill trolls. I have never rolled a 9-foot mountain troll but I do have two, 9-0 hill trolls on my account. On average, from my experience, hill trolls were bigger, over hundreds of rolled characters.

2020/08/18 00:55, Boent:edited 1x   
@Moonglum Well that's possible. I'm only stating my perception based on my experience but I also didn't spend a lot of time rolling heights.

2020/08/18 01:05, Gagni: 
Well, Troth is a cave troll:

You are eight feet seven and weigh fifty-eight stone and five pounds.

And I also this tiny mountain troll in my account:

You are eight feet one and weigh forty-five stone and nine pounds.

Seems I'm rolling the littler trolls then the rest of ya.

2020/08/18 01:13, Moonglum:   
I EXPECTED mountain trolls to be larger as mountains are larger than hills ... I believe I was wrong. It wasn't until I started creating a slew of level-1 hill trolls and compared average height-weight to mountain trolls that I was corrected by the actual data.

2020/08/18 03:32, Cronus: 
Muk is 9' tall 63 stone. Casull is 6'5' and 31 stone 8 lbs. Made roughly 80 trolls to get casull. Muk was my very first. Guess I got lucky. If I remember right Muk can wear all but plate from muranog.

2020/08/18 03:35, Cronus: 
Muk is a mountain troll and Casull is a cave troll.

2020/08/18 06:02, Vogon:   
I've also heard that sex of the troll will affect size?

2020/08/18 08:30, Cronus: 
Sex is probably the biggest size factor.

2020/08/31 01:01, Troth: 
Yes, sex does make us bigger.

2020/09/02 08:58, Enforcer: 
I rolled 120 trolls to get the smallest one I got and it was 6,5 like Cronus'. Couldn't wear any puke stuff yet though. Havent tested too much though.
Biggest is 9,2 or 9,0 if im not mistaken. I havent noticed any difference in height based on subrace.

2020/09/02 11:22, Eldaril: 
What you can wear is conditional on both height and weight, and trolls will always be a lot heavier than other races that are the same size.

2021/09/18 06:54, Vurv:   
Took roughly 300 attempts to create 10 max size mountain trolls (9 feet) all with varying stats of str, dex, will, con. Same goes for Min size mountain troll (7'11). Did not try HIll or Cave sub races.

Leveled both a Min and Max Troll with same stats and pracs (unarmed, bash, parry, endurance) to level 10. Saw no difference in prac% and any of the info stats between the two Trolls. No noticeable differences between the two while solo xping. They both seemed to Hit, Bash and Parry the same mobs equally.

Leveled 8 max sized Trolls with varying stats to level 25. Charted prac percentages in all the skills. Str from 20-25 did not seem to have impact on 'unarmed' percentages. Dex and Wil were the only stats showing an influence. Was able to get to 101% unarmed with Str ranging from 20-25 and Dex/Wil at 14. Damage done was not investigated but experience seems more STR equals higher damage.

Hopes this helps.

Sorry Dain for the explosive numbers of newly created characters and a few name change requests.

2021/09/18 10:58, Dearth:   
Hey Vurv, we did similar tests here, maybe interesting: [submitted link]

Results are consistent with yours.

Max height has better keep-at-bay.
I wonder if the race affects which metals fit you: can 9ft mountain/hill/cave wear Muranog metals?
Can trolls resize metals as Dol Guldur citizens?

2021/09/18 17:50, One:   
Trolls can mend in dg once citizen

2021/09/18 19:29, Vurv:   
Stats for Max (34/34) Unarmed % for 9 Foot Mountain Trolls


A 25 5 5 14 19 14 7 101
B 22 5 5 14 20 14 11 101
C 20 8 5 14 20 14 13 101

D 24 8 5 12 21 14 9 98
E 23 8 5 12 21 14 11 98

F 22 12 5 11 22 10 13 93


G 21 6 5 14 20 13 14 99
H 25 5 5 13 21 13 8 98
I 25 7 5 12 22 12 9 95

2021/09/18 22:36, Neamir: 
DG smith does not resize, only mend, iirc.

2021/09/19 22:07, Troth: 
So, you might as well ignore STR in the equation for unarmed then, since it would be nonsense to make an unarmed troll with less than 20 base STR, IMO.

The data here and at Dearth's link suggests something like (lumping STR into the constant) 68+0.89*DEX+1.44*WIL.

However, if you ignore the lowest data set (11 DEX and 10 WIL), you get 56.3+1.23*DEX+1.96*WIL, which matches the data for anything in the high 90's or above for unarmed extremely well.

2021/09/21 10:15, Antrax:edited 1x   
Do not forget that str also gives +1ob/point.

As far as I'm aware, height doesn't only helps with keep at bay rolls, but it also brings additional damage on fall. Since even the smallest trolls are taller than your average puke/zorc, you will nearly never get kept at bay by spear users, regardless of height. The fall damage difference is not that great either, so if you are not going to use stabbing weapons, i wouldn't really bother rolling a tall troll, just go with whatever height you get.

Trolls clad in metals are more of an edge scenario, where you want to tank for xp train or whatnot, but with healing up and troll's very good defence, you can tank just fine in plains. That, and being able to get yourself nosize fullset of fine metals makes it not worth bothering to height roll.

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